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I'm excited to announce that the Pediatric Dental Marketing Course is officially open for enrollment!
This comprehensive course, developed by Minal Sampat and myself, is tailored specifically for pediatric practice owners and their teams. It is designed to turn your pain points into stepping stones for success, and to help you become the trusted dental home for countless children in your community. Head over to our site to enroll now! https://pediatricdentalmarketingcourse.com/
Guest: Kyle Roth
Business Name: Encompass Dental Transitions
Check out Kyle's Media:
Website: https://encompass-ihc.com/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drkyleroth/
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kyle-roth-dds
Other Mentions and Links:
Green Lights - Matthew McConaughey
Host: Michael Arias
Website: The Dental Marketer
Join my newsletter: https://thedentalmarketer.lpages.co/newsletter/
Join this podcast's Facebook Group: The Dental Marketer Society
My Key Takeaways:
- Try having the majority of your services done in-house! Referring might sound easy, but patients don't want to travel down the road to get work done.
- You do NOT need to be at the cutting edge of technology. Investing in new technology is important, but don't get carried away with every brand new toy.
- Annually, it's much easier to ramp up a 600k practice to 1.2 million, than it is to grow a 1 million dollar practice to a 2 million dollar practice. Keep this in mind if acquiring a practice!
- Small towns can be a gold mine for opportunity with patients! You may have more practice buyers in a city location though.
- Internal marketing is vastly underutilized in dental practices. Have a system for marketing to your patients!
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Episode Transcript (Auto-Generated - Please Excuse Errors)
Michael: Kyle, how's it going?
Kyle: It's going great. How are you doing?
Michael: I'm doing pretty good, man. Thanks for asking. If you could tell us a little bit about your past, your present, how'd you get to where you are today?
Kyle: Well, that's a long road, but, uh, I graduated in, uh, 1999, which is a long time ago now, but, uh, My, my plans were to buy a dental practice and pretty much going to be working at that one dental practice my entire life.
And it really didn't work out that way at all. It, uh, lots of things happened. Lot of good things happened. some not so good, but most of the things were really good. got outta school and we ended up. we either started from scratch or purchased 36 practices. And, uh, also in the middle of all that I was selling a few practices and, uh, we had some brokerage help.
Which was not the best of help. And I thought with, I have a, uh, actually I've got a financial background before dentistry. Hmm. Uh, I, I thought that maybe we could do better than, than the help that we got. We could hold the hand of the dentist going through the, uh, procedure, going through the, uh, the sale, the transition, and, uh, help them financially.
And, uh, we did, so we became a broker. At first it was more of a hobby and now we're probably one of the top five biggest in the country. So it's, uh, it is been a lot of fun. Nice.
Michael: What's the name of the company?
Kyle: company is Encompass Dental Transitions.
Okay.
Michael: Okay. Nice man. But let's rewind a little bit. Okay. In 1999, you graduated and you planned to buy one dental practice. Correct. Did you always want to, or was there even before that you're like, I just wanna be an associate, or, no, you always had the plan of buying your own practice.
Kyle: I, you know, when I graduated, if you were gonna get in private practice, you would go out there and just as soon as you graduated, open a practice.
Uh, some people worked as associates, but most of 'em didn't. They just, if they knew what they wanted to do. They went and bought something and, and things have changed a little bit too with the banks, right? I mean, they were really anxious to, to land. I got my first loan halfway through senior year. I mean, I still had to take board exams and everything.
I could have failed. Mm-hmm. But, uh, we started building a building from scratch in 1999. And, uh, it finished not too long after I graduated.
Michael: Yeah. No, that's good. And then you said you, there's a lot of good things that happened and not so good things. Talk to me about the good things that happened.
Kyle: Well, the, the, the good things were, you know, I, I, the, the first office I had meant to be high end, super high end for, for this area. We had stuff that nobody had. Uh, and it was a very cool, Practice. We were not gonna see any insurance. It was gonna be all a hundred percent fee for service. And it was working pretty well at first, September 11th, got cracked pretty hard all of a sudden, because of all of the drama unfolding with September 11th.
the patients didn't come to the practice anymore. We were like, oh God, we're either gonna become, we're gonna have to see some insurance companies, or we're gonna let some people go. And I couldn't, I didn't have the heart to let people go. So we started seeing some insurance, a whole lot of it. and even in the meantime, we were seeing some Medicaid until I got busy.
I said I might as well see a little bit. So I did, when it was such a big deal, the newspaper came to us and said, why are you seeing Medicaid? Nobody does that. And I just said, well, I've gotta be busy. I'd rather learn and, and be, be paid something even though it's not a lot of money, it's something, uh, rather than sit around and watch TV and wait for patients to come.
But what happened is the office was getting torn up a little bit, cuz it wasn't always the best type of patient coming in. Mm-hmm. Things were disappearing and getting torn up a little bit. So I've, I said I've gotta come up with a solution to this. and what I came up with is just moving all of the Medicaid patients into a completely different office somewhere, and then making my single office by itself, or fee for service and, and, uh, private patients, ramping it up, making it as nice as I possibly could.
But what happened is that Medicaid patient, a Medicaid office that I did open, Was slapped. I mean, because nobody in my town took it at all. But we had, from day one, we had two doctors in there six days a week. And it was, even to this day, it was the most profitable practice I've ever had. Uh, so I, I got two practices and I'm going, okay, now the, The shines and the bekos and the, Patterson Dentals were like, Hey, there's another empty office around the corner here.
You wanna do that one too? And I'm like, not really, but let me take a look at it. And I'd look at it, I'm like, wow, we could open the third office. So we just kept doing that. Um, I became a part-time professor over at UNC Chapel Hill, and my students would always ask, Do you have an office in whatever town?
Let's, let's say it's, uh, 20 minutes away and I'd say, well, no. I don't necessarily have a an office there that you can work at when you graduate, but I could build one. So I'd build an office. They'd go in there, they'd work in it, they'd build it up, and I'd always give them first opportunity to buy from me.
The office they built up and buy it at a discount. So, you know, I'd, I'd have 3, 4, 5, 6 offices, then it'd go down, I'd sell a few, appeal a few off to new grads, and uh, it went, went on like that forever. So I didn't plan that business model, but, That's what seemed to have worked out. And, uh, it was good. I mean, if you want to hear the bad stuff, uh, we did a mobile dental unit.
We thought we could go to some small towns with this mobile dental unit. Mm-hmm. So we built the, the nicest mobile dental unit, probably on the earth. It was, uh, three operatories. It had a amazing sound system. It was wrapped in, uh, photos of North Carolina from the, from the coast to the mountains. And we had a place where we could stick magnets in all the little counties and, uh, cities that we went to in the, in the, uh, state.
And, uh, but it was more or less a disaster. we would, I have a, a bunch of small town government people reach out to us and say, Hey, that would be amazing if you would come to our town. I said, well, how do we get the message out that we're gonna be there at a certain day, certain time. They said, make some flyers for us.
We'll have it already when you come. We'll, we'll advertise for you. And we'd get there and there'd be nobody, it was just, completely dead. And it, it would cost us about $2,000 to roll that thing out, basically to pay a doctor, uh, staff fuel. we'd, we'd spend $2,000 going to a town and in some cases there wasn't a single patient.
We sat there all day and nothing. So there were, there were a few disasters along the way. the name of the bus itself was Smiles for Miles. Um, but it, it, it quickly became frowns for Miles. I mean, that's what some of my staff would call it. But, uh, there was that.
Michael: Okay, man. Wow. Would, would you do that again or would you ever do a mobile unit or No, no.
I,
Kyle: I, I wouldn't. It could be done, but you have to have the staff on there that love it. I mean, we went into some poor neighborhoods, super poor neighborhoods and I loved it cuz we went and we had, we worked on kids through Medicaid and stuff and uh, you know, they would, the kids would, they had a hard life man.
Like some of them would say, Hey, we couldn't sleep last night. There was gunshots all night long in our neighborhood. And uh, but it was amazing cuz we bought them pizza and we, we'd have a little party. And all the kids have the time of their life getting stuff that they don't normally get. but it, it was a labor of love and not everybody's yeared for that, you know?
Yeah. Going to a different town every day. It's, it's, uh, it's tough.
Michael: Yeah. No, I get you, man. I get you. But, so then rewind a little bit. I mean, you made it sound so easy, Kyle, like, where you're like, oh, we just bought something and then sold it and bought another practice for my student and sold it. Is it the.
Kyle: Well, I, I, I'll tell you, it was easier when I, when I graduated. Mm-hmm. For sure. Things were easier. I didn't have as much competition. I really didn't, uh, especially in North Carolina. North Carolina was one of those states that people that wanted to move here had to take the North Carolina board exam, and you'd have the good old boy network that wanted to keep people out.
So they'd go in there and there, there'd be somebody from, let's just say, New York. they would take the exam and then you'd see these good old boys administering the exam saying, nice work, son. But try again next year. You didn't quiet Megan. You know, and, uh, you know, and I think the, the board got a lot of heat eventually, and they can't do that anymore.
So now we've got, we have, uh, dentists coming from. Everywhere. Everywhere and every time there's an article in the magazine saying that the Carolinas, Raleigh, and Charlotte are one of the top places in the country to live. You've got more and more. So it's now it's bumper cars of dentists, everybody's right down the street next to each other.
It's all fighting for the same dollar and it's, it's tough. Yeah.
Michael: So right now you currently have four, right?
Kyle: Yes.
Michael: Up and running. Are you planning to sell more
Kyle: or no? I, I'm really not. I want to, I'd love to just keep it as is right now. inevitably we're gonna buy some more stuff. I've, I, I've seen a few little bargains out there recently that nobody else wants.
Kind of the ugly duckling, you know? some of these places still have paper charts, you know, they, they've got a dark room. And when every, anybody that's graduated in the last 10 years, they see paper charts and a, uh, dark room. They immediately give it to Heisman and they're on their way out the door.
and I don't want to buy those, but eventually the doctor's like, Hey, I need to retire. What do I need to do? What I wanted to tell 'em is, yeah, you really needed to add digital years ago, paperless, all of those things. But at this point, I can give you x number of dollars. And I can pay you cash and, you know, I'll take over and I'll renovate everything.
so I do, and more often than not, I can offer them anything and they just want to get out, you know, they're done. it's fairly easy to take a lot of those. A lot of those are completely fee for service. They haven't modernized anything. They may have shagged carpeting and, By that time they've got, um, yellow stickies all over the waiting room saying, no smoking, no cell phones, no this, no that.
And it's, so we just gut the whole thing. We renovate the entire place, put some modern stuff in there, even if we have to buy it used and we can get it going. And we open it up to insurances too, because a lot of these guys, their office has been dying over the years because it's a hundred percent fee for service.
And when some of their old clientele passes away or moves, there's nobody there to take the place, you know? So we are opening up to the better insurance companies. We are doing marketing. Some of these guys don't even have a, a website. Uh, so we're having to do a lot of things to bring, bring people in the door, but just.
The beautiful renovations that we do, people come in that have been coming there for 10 years and they go, oh my God, this is gorgeous. And then they tell five friends, and then those people come in. So it's, uh, especially in some of the smaller towns, it's still fairly easy in, in the big cities.
It's, it's, it's a challenge, but it's still very doable. Yeah.
Michael: So whenever you see a bargain, Kyle, you look at it, it's a bargain. You're like, I can't let this pass up. You buy it. And you kind of do that, the B R R R R method, right? Like you're like, bye, I am gonna like, or I dunno if you refinance and all that stuff, but like, you rehab it, you make it look really nice and then you sell it or you're more like, okay, no, I'm,
Kyle: keep it, no look really nice.
Then we, we hire some hardworking associates and put 'em in there and we, we try to mentor them as much as we possibly can, and when we get the numbers up, we make the phone ring. We do everything we can do to make that phone ring and ring and ring and start scheduling. Uh, a lot of those guys, a lot of the older doctors too, keep in mind they weren't diagnosing anything.
So some of it existing patients, if you just get in there and diagnose all those ratty old amalgams that are fractured 17 times, but they're still in the mouth, they need to come out. So some of it's like, it's, it, it's a. Crown and bridge Factory immediately when you get some of those places, you know, it's, it's, you don't wanna overwhelm the people who thought they were good all these years by going, yeah, you probably need about five crowns.
Well, my former dentist didn't tell me anything. Everything was good. You know, I, I don't wanna say anything and I don't wanna throw the guy under the bus, but the guy should have been diagnosing these things over the years and doing them. So some of it's just doing the work. Some of it's doing some advertising.
keeping more in-house, try trying to find a way to keep everything in-house. The old school way is they, they'd refer everything, anything they didn't wanna do, they referred it. Mm-hmm. But no, it's, it's, it's harder. You have to learn how to do endo. You have to be, do some basic implant placement, some ortho, all those things.
People don't want to be sent all over the town to get work done. They wanna be able to get it done right there. So we do everything we do to keep everything in house. Gotcha.
Michael: how do you make the phone ring, like constantly? Like what is your guys' method?
Kyle: Well, it's, there's a lot of things that go into it. Um, we, we have a marketing person that's all she does is social media and, uh, some mark other types of marketing, but, just a good website, paying for AdWords. we do, uh, internal marketing too. Everyone has a good experience. We make sure to, to ask them.
Just say, hey, without, without sounding desperate to say, Hey, we wanna take care of good people just like you. So if you can send your family and friends, we'll take good care of them too. You know it, uh, People forget about the internal marketing. It's probably more important than the external stuff. And it's free, but you gotta do it.
And it's, people will start doing it and then they kind of fall off and they don't do it anymore. But it's super important. Yeah.
Michael: Okay. So it's like a little of everything, right? You kind of invest in, in that. So then how do you find a good bargain?
Kyle: Well, unfortunately, the, the bargain finds me more often than It's just like it gets presented to me. They're like, nobody else wants this practice. Do you want it because it's ugly? It's an ugly duckling. But because we've done it so many times, I really can walk in and if, if the chairs, the units, the lights are all functional, the compressor, the vac, all of those things are in good shape, even if I have to recover the chairs.
I will look to try to sell them, but I know they're not gonna sell. but I just look at all of the opportunities. I like hygiene. To me, that's one of the biggest telltale signs of a good practice. People brag like, oh my God, I've got two hygienists. And if you want to get, get in and get your teeth cleaned as a new patient, it's gonna take six months.
Then it's like, uh oh, CHCH. I can see that I'm going. That's an opportunity. Even if you look at the doctor's schedule, like I said, he's got nothing on his schedules cuz he doesn't want anything on his schedule. You know, there's a lot of things to be done, but he doesn't wanna do 'em. So he is just going, know, with each hygiene appointment, you know, the recare appointment.
He's just going, Hey, how you doing? We'll see you in six months, you know? And it's, that happens more often than you think. When the guy is getting really, really close to retirement, he don't wanna do anything anymore.
Michael: Yeah. Gotcha. Okay. So mainly the bargains kind of go to you. What, so then let me ask you, Kyle, what's your area of expertise like right now?
Kyle: You mean in the brokerage world? Yeah,
Michael: or just like, yeah, what you would, if I were to go to you, what can you help
Kyle: me out with? Well, I, I can help you out with a lot of things. I can help you. If you're looking to purchase a practice, I can tell you what to look for. we can help you in your search too.
Like if I know somebody wants to be in Austin, Texas, we can send an email blast to everybody in that area. Uh, we do have connections. We've got strategic partners also that have, uh, email addresses and phone numbers of every doc in that area. So we have access to that. We can help them look. We could even go through that office if they needed us to, if we're, if we're in that area, or at least a walkthrough, somebody can walk through with a phone, with a FaceTime.
Mm-hmm. And show me what the practice looks like. Show me what the street, the, how busy it is on the road, the signage and everything. I can look at the, look at the books and I can, I can pretty much tell you if it's gonna be a good purchase opportunity or not, and I can look at the trajectory based on. the collections over the last few years, and I can look at the expenses, but also when they're selling the practice, same thing.
We've done this so many times, that it's, we can do it in our sleep. Really, hundreds and hundreds of practices over the years. know all of the equipment and how we differ from a lot of brokers. There's a lot of brokers that are accountants attorneys, and they're good with numbers. Don't get me wrong, but they don't know old equipment from new equipment.
And because we had 36 practices and a lot of everybody's old equipment over the years, we know what's good and what's not good, you know? that's the way I guess, that we really can help people get started. Uh, we have the bankers that are, uh, very dental friendly. We've got attorneys that are dental friendly.
We've got accounting, uh, we've got an accounting, uh, firm that works with just dentists and doctors. We're able to steer like a new grad in the direction they need to go with all the proper professionals. Uh, and, and even getting started themselves. We've got people within my company, my C E O O on the side, will help some of the people get started with checklists of all the things they need to get accomplished.
So she'll do that on the side. Just to help people that have never been through the process before, because it is the first time I lost quite a bit of hair the first time. It's a, it's a nerve-wracking thing and you gotta think some of these people have never worked anywhere. Mm-hmm. I mean, they're, they're going straight through school, through high school, undergrad, dental school, and then straight into a job somewhere.
And, they may have worked at, uh, McDonald's over a summer sometime, but a lot of them, they've never even done that. Mm-hmm. So they don't know payroll, they don't know personnel, they don't know, purchasing, there's, there's so many different things that you've gotta learn really quick.
It's doable. It's just, it's, it's, it's a lot of work. It's a little bit of a stress at, at, at first, uh, till you get started. Nice.
Michael: Okay. Okay, man. So I, I appreciate that, that everything you guys do to help out with that like acquisition, to find the place and everything. What are some good purchases then?
What are some like things we can be looking out for when it comes to, this is a bargain, this is something good. And then what are some, I guess, Things we need to look out for. That can be tricks. For example, I remember the doctor I worked for here in, um, Paris, California. She had multiple practices, but I can tell like when she brought me on to just market, she's like, I gotta get these numbers up to look good right now.
Bring in you pa. And so was she trying to deceive it or, I don't know what was happening. You know what I mean? In that scenario, at that time,
Kyle: Well, it's, was she going to sell the practice
Michael: to you? No, not to me. She was just gonna sell the practice once I was bringing in new patients.
And it's like they, we just gotta make it look like there's a lot. And then I heard, I overheard that with the consultant and I was like, okay, that's why I'm here. then, sure. You
Kyle: know what I mean? For ramp up the numbers so that she can get a good sale. That's, that's exactly what you're there for.
But, You're getting paid for it too, you know? Mm-hmm. But there's a lot of people, you know, it used to be the $400,000 office. If you put an associate in there, uh, there was no owner operator, just an associate in there. $400,000 was the typical break even point. Uh, but now it's more like $600,000. Uh, the breakeven point after they pay the associate after they pay everything, uh, there's really nothing.
So when you go to purchase something like that, the banks don't love, those three to $600,000 practices. They don't like it at all. some of them are still willing to, to loan on that, but you kind of have to have a little proven track record as an associate in order for them to trust you. Like if they can see you're personally.
You're generating a a million dollars on your own, then they're gonna feel a little bit more comfort in that. If they see you on a daily basis working as an associate, you can provide some information that shows you know what you're doing. That makes it a little easier. the million dollar practices, the banks will loan on that all day long, but to me it's tougher to grow a million dollar practice into a $2 million practice to double it.
Then to take a $600,000 practice and make it 1.2, that's super easy to do that. Hmm.
Michael: Talk to me about that. Then. How can we make it for the, cuz we have a lot of listeners who are like not hitting a million yet. Right. Then we have some who are wanting to get to the 2 million, obviously. Right. Right.
So how do
Kyle: we do that? How do I do it? It's, first of all, like I said, it's advertising external, internal. Having the right equipment. I don't think you need to lead the technology curve. you don't need to be the first in line to buy all the, these toys, but some of the toys as they get a little older, are getting very inexpensive and they still do their job.
Like the a Cerac machine from four years ago, I promise you works just fine. It it, you know, there might be something newer and fancier. The older stuff. We put a billion crowns in with the Cerac machine. They work, then they work. Now it's, it's just maybe not the top of the line. It's, uh, so what do we do?
We, we keep everything in house. The procedures in house. We're not referring everything out. We work off hours. I used to, in my office, I'd be there seven to three. And at, uh, two 30 I had another doctor come in and he'd work into the evenings, uh, working. Saturdays, Sundays, whatever it takes. If you're in a busy shopping center that's loaded with people on Saturday and Sunday, why wouldn't you have some hours then?
I know it's a little bit harder on the doctor, but that's, that's what associates are for. I, I'd put them in there. Then, you know, get some people to wor willing to work some off hours and the numbers will come. They will. Gotcha. Okay.
Michael: That's good, man. So then these are the things we wanna look for. When it comes to a good purchase, then if, if we're looking for a bargain.
You said, you mentioned before, the specific steps, right?
Kyle: Yeah. Well, if you're looking for a bargain, look for something that's only open Monday through Thursday. Old school. Look for something that's just B for service, but it's dying. It's dying on the vine. Look for an office that's, it's just ugly. They haven't put anything in there.
They haven't redecorated in 25 years. Old equipment. Uh, don't be afraid of the old stuff. It's paint and flooring and lighting and, uh, digital equipment is just not that expensive. Yeah, if you're gonna buy a CT machine, it's a little bit more expensive, but a used digital pan, it's almost free now because people are putting the cts in.
Is, is the CT necessary? Depends what you're doing. If you're placing implants, it'd be nice to have that. but anyway. Yeah.
Michael: Okay. And now I, Kyle, I've heard two types, types of things when it comes to startups and acquisitions. I've heard people make startups, right, because meaning like I build it out, right.
Um, not even to shell it out, it's just from the ground up. I build it out because I can't find anything that I want in the PO location that I want or something like that. Right. It's my brand. Right, right. And then I've also heard. Someone say, you will always find what you want in an acquisition. You usually need patience and then you run outta patience and then you just decide to make up your own startup.
Right?
Kyle: Which one? Well, I'll tell you, I, when I first started this, I did new starts all the time cuz it was just easy. Even if I was in a small town somewhere, I'd find a shell do all the building cuz I, I like doing the building anyway. And we, we built ours more like we would, we would take a lot of design ideas from the W Hotel, some really cool stuff, super modern inside, no clutter, uh, as little clutter as possible.
Lots of room, high ceilings. Uh, we even like the, the shopping centers with the super high ceilings, exposed beams and plumbing and stuff. Uh, we had great music. Music was part of, uh, what we did. Some really cool, uh, l e d lighting. We didn't do overhead fluorescence ever. Everybody had, in fact, we didn't even have lights on the chairs.
Everybody had overhead lights, little headlights. The, uh, assistants, hygienists and doctors all had that stuff. So it was just a very soothing feeling when you walked into our offices. And, uh, it was kind of cool, you know, but, um, getting back to the point. for a new start now it's you're, you're spending at least $500,000 to maybe have two operatories and not have a single patient.
and like I said, it's harder. back when I was doing the new start, I would advertise and the day we opened, we'd have at least, half of the office was booked right away. But as I got a little older, it got harder and harder and harder to do. And almost all the time now I buy an existing practice because with, even with as much experience as I have in all of the hookups, I get stuff for very inexpensive compared to a lot of people.
so even with all the hookups, it's difficult to do a fresh start. It's, I'm not gonna say it's impossible, but I tried to buy an existing cash flow. Uh, from day one.
Michael: Okay. If people were to go with you guys, do we also get to be a part of those hookups
Kyle: or, you know, I, I've tried for a long time to get them to pass on the exact prices and they're not willing to, to give those prices, but they certainly will give you better than a rack rate.
You know, like if, if you just go in and call, uh, one of the big dental companies. they're gonna give you what they give everybody else. You know, it's a standard rate, what they're gonna give to you. I can get people some discounts. it's definitely gonna be better and I can point 'em in the right direction with, like I said, accounting with banks.
Save a little bit of money here and there. But, also people that will help negotiate your fees if they're with PPOs. I've got people that'll do that for you. I've got people that, um, with credit card, that work with credit card processing to give you the best possible rate. We've got lots and lots of people that we can refer to that are professional, that save people money, let's put it that way.
Mm-hmm.
Michael: Okay, man, that's good stuff. Good stuff. All right, so then these next questions just to get into the head of someone who isn't totally involved on the clinical side anymore. Right. I know it was like, it's been four years, you said, right? Right. Since you've done this full-time, so from this point, What would you like to see more from a dentist, from your perspective?
Kyle: Right. Uh, one thing I miss from the new dentist is there's a lot of younger dentists that I don't see at the big dental meetings anymore. It used to be a thing where you wanted to get some trainings in continuing education, you'd take your whole staff. for instance, we went to L V I. you know, L v I, Las Vegas Institute.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. We'd take the entire staff and we'd learn together and we'd learn to sell together. So it was, when we do, we'd presented a treatment plan. I didn't have to present that treatment plan because I didn't go there by myself, learn by myself. Everybody is presenting it before I even walk in the door.
You know, the, the hygienist is, looking in there and going, okay, this is what I think he's gonna propose. This is what I'm think, I think would be great for you, some veneers, whatever it might be. So I'd walk in the room and everything is been laid out before I even walk in. I don't have to sell anything.
The patient's basically turning around and going, Hey Doc, I'm gonna get. Uh, veneers is on, uh, you know, tooth number five through 11 or whatever. Mm-hmm. And, uh, it, it's, I still think it's important for the entire team to be involved. Uh, I don't think that's gone away. I see a lot of people getting their continuing education online, and it's not the same as working on a, a pig skull or something, learning how to do.
Implants or extractions or whatever. I think it's still, super important to go take lots and lots and lots of continuing education. I think that's the single thing that made me. Able to grow as fast as I did. As we were crazy about ce, we continually, we took every course on the earth and because every time we'd go out there and take a course, we'd come back and we'd make more money.
We were more successful. And when the patient looked to us and said, Hey, do you do this procedure? We go, yes, we do. We're not gonna have to send you anywhere. We're gonna do it right here. So,
Michael: yeah. Do you think, um, maybe like. The lockdown, COVID kind of had a big push on that, the transition
Kyle: where it's like huge, huge.
Everybody got kind of, I don't know. They're, they, they were okay with just learning from their computer, learning from their phone, but I will tell you it's not the same. It really isn't. Yeah.
Michael: Yeah. I agree. That interaction, that p people to people, right. Also like mm-hmm. Camaraderie and everything like that.
It's, it's, it's different. It's whole different. You need that face
Kyle: to face. Can I? There's more opportunity in, you know, everyone loves the cities now. Everybody's in the city, city, city, city. everybody wants a practice in the city. Some of the small towns are the best opportunities ever. Now, granted, when you go to sell that practice in the small town, it's more difficult.
Uh, but everything is cheaper during, uh, if you bought something in a small town right now, All of your labor is cheaper, your supplies are gonna be the same, but you're, it, it's a little bit harder to find a doctor to work there, the associate doctors to go into small towns, it's really difficult. But if you do get somebody, maybe you give that doctor, um, an opportunity to buy in.
He's got some skin in the game, then probably he's not gonna leave. those small towns, you can still kill it relatively quickly because you just don't have that much competition, you
Michael: know? Yeah. That's interesting you say that. Like I, I just got off the, an interview with a, a doctor in a rural area and he was saying how like a patient got upset and then. I asked like, oh, what are you go, did they leave? Do they immediately go? He's like, no, the closest person is three hours. They, they have no other option but to come to me. You know, so that's right. They have that pow or not power, but like, you know what I
Kyle: mean? Right. But, and, and the other thing is it, it was easy for me to go into small towns because when I would do, when I would renovate an office there in the small towns, There was no dental office that looked like ours.
None. Mm-hmm. So people would be blown away when they'd come in and they'd, they'd immediately get on their phones and take pictures and send it to all their friends and, yeah. So it's, uh, it looked like a club in there really. I mean, it was very, We'd have stone walls and all the operatories with, um, a nice, uh, l e d light on it.
And the music was good. And it was just like people would come and hang out. They just wanted to be there, you know? Yeah.
Michael: That's nice. That's, that's what you wanna like, kind of make a atmosphere like that. That's right. Right, right. Now Kyle, what do you really dislike or hate about dentistry?
Kyle: What do I hate about it?
Well, obviously the lack of ability to get employees right now, especially hygienist, I think is a, is a nationwide problem. Right. Uh, and the dentistry used to be amazing. Like to make a living out of dentistry, you really didn't have to do much. I mean, when I first graduated, it was a four day work week. and you really, you could refer things out.
Uh, anything that you didn't wanna do, just refer it out. there were lots of things that were just a lot easier. Um, so things are, not only are they way more expensive, and I will tell you that the profit margin used to be fantastic in dentistry. Mm-hmm. And you can make a lot of mistakes. It can still be fine, but now you've got to, you've gotta make less mistakes.
You've gotta be, you have to have a little bit more financial knowledge now. Now it doesn't, it's not good enough to be a good dentist. You've gotta be a little bit of a businessman too, and a little bit of a salesperson. I know it's a, sales is a dirty word and the, and the, in the dental business, but you are, you're selling cases, you're not, everybody needs veneers.
Very few people need them. A lot of people want them, but, um, it's changed a little bit. It's just a little bit more difficult, I guess. It's still a good living. It's still a great job. It's, we just had it maybe the best ever. You know, I think we graduated might have been the best, uh, 20 years ever.
Really?
Michael: Yeah. Okay. Nice. And then, so right now, what do you love about
Kyle: dentistry? what I love about dentistry. There's some things that are pretty cool, like the artificial intelligence that's reading x-rays now, okay? If, if you took bite wings and somebody had several, incipient lesions, some of them were into the dentons, some were close.
If you gave those x-rays to 10 different dentists, you're gonna get 10 different answers of what needs to be done, right? But now they've got some artificial intelligence that's reading X-rays and it's gonna be more consistent, I think. I think the, uh, everything is getting easier. Implants, everybody's trained on implants now.
Mm-hmm. Uh, they've even got some robotics. Like even if you're not trained, you can have a hands across the different part of a world, guiding you and, and, and doing, uh, implants. So the technology's really cool. I think that, that the education is better than it's ever been. so there's a lot of good things in dentistry.
It's financially, it's a little bit more difficult, but there are some really, really interesting technological things that are gonna make dentistry easier and better. You're gonna become a better dentist. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And things can be done on the spot. They're gonna mill that crowd on the spot. Yes.
They've been doing that for a long time. But hopefully everything gets just a little bit faster and, uh, you're able to insert it, cement it, be done with it that day so people don't have to keep coming back. Yeah,
Michael: yeah. No, yeah, you're right. Convenience, right? Well, the AI software, you're talking
Kyle: about's gotten so much easier.
Ortho's gotten easier. You can do six miles Invisalign. Uh, there's so many of the things that used to be left to the specialist and now the general dentist can do it. But the general dentist kind of has to do some of those things just to keep stuff in house anyway. So you have to do those things, but at least they're making it easier for you to do them.
Gotcha.
Michael: Is there any specific company you've seen recommend when it comes to that type of software, like AI software?
Kyle: No, actually I don't, I, one of my friends sells it, and I can't even tell you the name of her company off the top of my head. She was just telling me all about it, and I'm just like, I think it's the greatest thing ever because it is true.
Like I'll have associates come in and they'll diagnose completely different than me. Anytime I see that little lesion getting just about touching the entin, I'm gonna, I'm, I'm gonna go ahead and, and put it as something that I'd need to restore because. Usually when I get in there, it's deeper than it looks on the x-ray.
so I would rather err to side of caution and get that done and not be the guy that missed it. but I would love to see people, diagnosing the same, uh, all across the board, you know? Mm-hmm.
Michael: Mm-hmm. Gotcha. So then any final piece of advice? Or suggestions or recommendations you want to give to people who are looking to either do their own practice acquisition or startup?
Kyle: Yeah, I guess don't look too early because people will come to me and they're, you know, they're a year from graduating. They're like, Hey, I wanna start looking at dental offices. And I tell 'em, there's no reason to look at them right now. I mean, The doctor's not gonna wanna show you if you're a year out.
Uh, and I'm not really, cuz you know, you're competing against a lot of people that wanna buy this office. So take your time a little bit. Study up on it though. Learn. You've gotta read a little bit about if you've never managed people before, what you can say to people, what you can do, because it's, um, there is a learning process to all of that.
It's, uh, identify? All the people that you're gonna use for accounting, payroll? there's a lot of things that you need to start thinking about. Who's gonna, who's gonna handle this for me? know what type of office you're gonna have. what are you gonna, what do you want to not specialize in, but what do you want to make it your thing?
I think it's a, it's good for every office to identify one particular part of dentistry. Where it's their thing. and I'll give you an example. Some people like dentures. Most dentists hate it. But if you could get really, really good at dentures, be quick with them. They stay in the person's mouth even sometimes without, an implant to latch onto you keep, became really good at, dentures.
You'd have business forever because doctors would be sending you that stuff here. I got a denture, I don't wanna deal with it. Take it. there's so many dentists I know that haven't done a denture since they graduated, so take it, make it your own. And, um, you know, I think that's one of the most important things that they need to be thinking about.
Michael: Nice. Okay. So I feel like you lived a lot in the sense of like, there's a lot that you've done, right? So, When it comes down to it, man, like just out of, I'm just curious, out of my own, you know, being nosy. what are some things where you're like, man, I should have avoided this. This is what hit us hard.
This is what made me go the extra mile. What are some things that were
Kyle: like that? Well, I, I got cocky in, in, I had my ass handed to me a few times. I don't know if I'm allowed to say that on here, but, uh, I'm like, I'd go into a busy area where there was a lot of dentists, but I. A great new building opened up.
It was not a dental building or something. I wanted to make it, my building. There was a lot of traffic there and I said, oh, I can do this. And it's, it just got harder. I, it just, um, there are some surprises out there. And if you're not careful, then you get caught with cash calls. You know, you may have purchased a practice already, but whoever's doing your payroll goes, uh, doctor, um, we don't have enough money in the account this month.
do you, can you write me a personal check? And, uh, that stuff will wake you up in a, in a hurry. So I made a few errors getting too cocky, uh, for my own good thinking, I can handle anything. I'll tell you one of the, in order for the associates to make an office good in a lot of places, they have to immerse themselves in the community.
You can't just expect patients to fall out of the sky. you have to have a business card when you are out for lunch. If they see you in scrubs or whatever, Hey, what do you do for a living? I'm a dentist. Oh, I need a dentist. Boom, you've got your card, you're handing it out. And we would try to go out to lunch as a team often, and get the word out that we're here.
And I try to get a lot of associates to go to fundraisers to make them, you know, go to the local church, go to this, go to that. And they, most of the time they can't be bothered to, to do any of that stuff. But I, I will say that don't expect patients to fall out of the sky in, in that particular case, you know, it's, you've gotta work on it yourself.
so I've learned a lot over the years. Don't buy a mobile unit unless you're really prepared and you've thought it out. Cause that was a disaster and we lost a lot of money on that one. so other than that, it's, um, fortunately we've been very, very successful and there's been very few places that we got caught on cash calls.
I will say it's, it happens more than it ever has. But it's, it's not fun to go through. So just, just be careful and watch every dollar. Don't listen to the salespeople that come and they try to sell you this and that, and just get the very basics. If you can buy used equipment, you can buy 20 year old chairs and recover them, and the patient will never know.
They'll think they're brand new chairs, so anything you can buy that's in great working shape, there are spare parts for that stuff. Buy 'em. You don't need to buy all brand new stuff, buy stuff with a good warranty. Mm-hmm.
Michael: Good. Hey, that's good. Awesome. Kyle, thank you so much for being with us, man. It's been a pleasure.
But before we say goodbye, can you tell our listeners where they can find you?
Kyle: Yes. We're at, uh, our website is encompass ihc.com. Inter integrated healthcare ihc.com. Also they can find me. It's, uh, Dr. Kyle Roth on Instagram. Uh, it's just Kyle Roth on Facebook. We're on LinkedIn. We're, we're everywhere on social media, but Instagram's the best place to keep up with us.
It's just Dr. Kyle, k y l e Roth, or o t h, our website. But, uh, Instagram is where it's going, where it's, you know, there's stuff going on there all the time. We do helpful videos for new grads. For people that are selling. Uh, we do fun stuff. We travel around the country. I've got an entire marketing team in Tiana Albania that helps me out with a lot.
so they'll be communicating with you if you need anything. They help out a lot. A lot Cool people. I've met a lot of the, uh, dentists over there in Albania too, and they're actually getting involved with us too now. So it, it's pretty cool. We've got a lot of strategic partners and also. If any of your, viewers have, uh, they know a dentist that's getting ready to sell, we pay really handsome referral fees.
Uh, if they send us that information, they tee it up for us an introduction, and we sell that practice. We, we pay a really, really nice referral fee. So there's that. Nice.
Michael: Okay. So guys, as you know, that's all gonna be in the show notes below. So check it out. And Kyle, thank you for being with us. It's been a pleasure and we'll hear from you soon.
Kyle: It's been a lot of fun.
